December 5, 2011

Clutch on "voter fraud"

Dear Professor Esenberg,
I'd be particularly interested in evidence of commentators who moreover believe that voter fraud simply can't happen. That would be a pretty remarkable position to take. Arguments against those people would be super-easy to develop. Easier, perhaps, than arguing against people who actually exist.
So, so funny.

7 comments:

John Foust said...

Well, there are known knowns; there are known unknowns; there are also unknown unknowns. Once you start talking about fraud you know exists but that you can't point to, the going gets weird, and the weird turn pro. The undercurrent of so many of those who defend Voter ID is that there is some large, percentage-swinging fraud carried out only by the Other Guys that has remained elusive and undetectable. You'd think the free market would've detected it by now.

illusory tenant said...

The best Jim Ott can come up with is, "Other people believe there's significant [voter] fraud. There's a lot of people that feel that there is." And he's one of the more powerful WISGOP committee members.

John Foust said...

Got it. Humans don't affect the climate, but somehow the Dems came up with a method of defrauding elections that the Republicans could not detect, adapt, or otherwise exploit.

Do we have any quotes from Republicans suggesting that Republican campaigns or Republican voters are the ones conducting the invisible fraud?

Rick Esenberg said...

I have debated this in the local, national and even international media (Lester Pines and I did a bit on the Voice of Russia.) First, it is not the case that there is no evidence of voter fraud. Second, it is true that, prior to the photo ID bill, it was possible to commit fraud with little risk of detection. Three, the response to the second point is never to refute it but to say that people would "never" do such a thing. Excuse me for lacking such robust and universal faith in human nature. Four, I have never said - in fact I am always careful not to say - that fraud is pervasive. Unfortunately, though,we have some very close elections.

John Foust said...

So, Professor, if we divided all the costs of implementing Voter ID by the number of cases of fraud in the last decade, what do we get?

(Republican punchline: Fewer Democrat voters!)

I look forward to your blog post about the counties that require photo ID to get the birth certificate you needed to get your voting photo ID.

Clutch said...

JF: "some large, percentage-swinging fraud carried out only by the Other Guys that has remained elusive and undetectable"

RE: "it is not the case that there is no evidence of voter fraud"

Interesting! Do the herrings get any redder?

"the response to the second point is never to refute it but to say that people would "never" do such a thing."

Interestinger! Such a surprise that people do not attempt to refute an attack on something they don't deny.

We may be getting closer to actual quotes from actual prominent discussants actually saying that people never do or never would commit voter fraud -- nobody, no-how, never happens, nuh-uh. At least now the word 'never' appears in quotation marks! As in, "never" has an entirely fictional lobby group saying fictional things been so thoroughly fisked.

Mike said...

Considering the effort Van Hollen was said to have put into investigating voter fraud, either the "evidence" is scant at best in Wisconsin, or Van Hollen isn't very good at his job. Possibly both.